COVID-19

[David L]

Just YouTube taking out the trash, not the New World Order shaking in their boots because someone who "does their own research" is on to them.

The data in the Cleveland Clinic study clearly indicated what they stated in their results:

"The risk of COVID-19 also varied by the number of COVID-19 vaccine doses previously received. The higher the number of vaccines previously received, the higher the risk of contracting COVID-19 (Figure 2)."

So Dr Kelly's presentation of this finding has been removed from Youtube, as has Dr John Campbell's. However they've not quite censored everyone....yet

Only a matter of time though.

The original study findings are still on the pre-print server (complete with the statement of their findings quoted above). No amendment or retraction...yet. Again, it's probably a matter of time before pressure is applied to the Cleveland Clinic (funding?) to force them to admit they've made an error.

Nice to see the BBC reporting on excess deaths tonight. Bit late to the party though

[Slim]

They've only been removed because it's misinformation, and potentially harmful. I'm glad to hear that Nurse Campbell's video has been removed.

In any case it's a ridiculous discussion because there's no doubt whatever that the vaccines have saved millions of lives. Perhaps you remember the statistics coming out of the US last August, with an epidemic of deaths among the unvaccinated in the redneck states.

To return to an earlier point you made:

I also did not read the full Telegraph article but provided it for context. I don't think this can go unaddressed for too much longer. The data needs an explanation. If you have one to proffer.....go for it

Thing is - I'm not sure the data really does require an explanation that isn't already apparent or wholly plausible. There's quite a thriving and engaged Flat Earth community out there, but I wouldn't expect Patrick Vallance to organise a team to investigate their suspicions, or their "data".

As you say, the BBC have touched on this and they recognise that there's nothing in the data to support that the vaccines have driven a rise in deaths.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-64209221

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/datasets/deathsbyvaccinationstatusengland

[David L]

Why would you want to censor the reporting of a publicly available study's findings? Misinformation? No, just information. Uncomfortable perhaps but most would agree, significant (at least until the findings are discredited).

I suppose one apparent and wholly plausible explanation for the significant increase in excess deaths would be the measures taken during the pandemic, wouldn't it?

[Slim]

The "findings" are still there:

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.12.17.22283625v1.full

I believe you've already conceded that they're "probably talking bollocks" in #225 of this thread.

I can't remember if I even watched the videos that have been removed. I would assume they probably applied some tin-foiler spin to them. I don't think it's very important.

I agree with your final paragraph, but if so it's a small offset compared to the lives saved.

[David L]

The "findings" are still there:
https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.12.17.22283625v1.full

Indeed they are. And still extremely interesting

I can't remember if I even watched the videos that have been removed. I would assume they probably applied some tin-foiler spin to them.

They didn't

I don't think it's very important.

😁

I agree with your final paragraph, but if so it's a small offset compared to the lives saved.

But growing..and at a significant rate

[David L]

Malhotra is a seriously disreputable figure,

Anyone told the BBC? 

I'd love a transcript of the director's comms into that presenter's earpiece. Someone got a bollocking, no doubt!
 

[Slim]

Yes, the BBC has received serious criticism for allowing Malhotra (who by the way wasn't actually invited to talk about the vaccines) to disseminate disinformation.

[Slim]

Patients admitted to hospital with COVID since the start of the pandemic. Two years ago we were just starting to descend from a massive spike; a year ago a smaller spike (though further spikes occurred in April and July '22), this year smaller still.

[David L]

Obesity linked to the metabolisation of vitamin D. Could be the reason that Covid-19 was such a danger to the obese

https://gizmodo.com/vitamin-d-supplements-weight-bmi-1850003146

[David L]

Patients admitted to hospital with COVID since the start of the pandemic. Two years ago we were just starting to descend from a massive spike; a year ago a smaller spike (though further spikes occurred in April and July '22), this year smaller still.

Only tells half the story IMHO. Those more recent spikes represent mostly patients for whom the virus causes little or no health issues. We are in an endemic phase now. The Omicron strains are the most transmissible but the least pathogenic.
The earlier peaks are not only greater but represent far more serious health implications for those involved.

[Slim]

I think that's probably true to a point, but since these are hospitalisations the health implications must still be serious. It's good news either way.

The absence of the vaccines is probably the biggest reason that spike's so big in early 2021.

Looking at deaths, unambiguously a serious outcome of course, the picture is similar early on but the deaths decline markedly after the vaccine rollout. That already seems to be the case before Omicron appears at the end of 2021.

[David L]

I'd certainly rank Russell as the most amusing purveyor of bollocks

Great fun   

[David L]

I think that's probably true to a point, but since these are hospitalisations the health implications must still be serious.

But, aren't the hospitalisations with Covid not because of Covid? The reasons for hospitalisation and indeed death may be totally unrelated to a Covid infection.
Have I got that wrong?

The absence of the vaccines is probably the biggest reason that spike's so big in early 2021.

Possibly more elderly and vulnerable. A lot affected by a more pathogenic virus in the first two waves.
And the smaller spikes afterwards could be caused by the presence of the vaccine. The more jabs, the more chance of catching Covid, possibly. Watch this space.

[David L]

I know both have been much maligned over the last couple of years when it comes to their coverage of the pandemic but this interview is just...interesting (but long!)
For his part, Oliver allows John Campbell to speak without goading him into sensationalism and hyperbole. Campbell comes across as knowledgeable and invested in his profession. The last few minutes where he discussed his thoughts on the current state of the NHS really resonated.

[Slim]

Grifters gonna grift.